John 17:5

17:5 And now, Father, glorify me at your side with the glory I had with you before the world was created.

Proverbs 8:21-31

8:21 that I may cause those who love me to inherit wealth,

and that I may fill their treasuries.

8:22 The Lord created me as the beginning of his works,

before his deeds of long ago.

8:23 From eternity I was appointed,

from the beginning, from before the world existed. 10 

8:24 When there were no deep oceans 11  I was born, 12 

when there were no springs overflowing 13  with water;

8:25 before the mountains were set in place –

before the hills – I was born,

8:26 before he made the earth and its fields, 14 

or the beginning 15  of the dust of the world.

8:27 When he established the heavens, I was there;

when he marked out the horizon 16  over the face of the deep,

8:28 when he established the clouds above,

when the fountains of the deep grew strong, 17 

8:29 when he gave the sea his decree

that the waters should not pass over his command, 18 

when he marked out the foundations of the earth,

8:30 then I was 19  beside him as a master craftsman, 20 

and I was his delight 21  day by day,

rejoicing before him at all times,

8:31 rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth, 22 

and delighting 23  in its people. 24 


tn Or “in your presence”; Grk “with yourself.” The use of παρά (para) twice in this verse looks back to the assertion in John 1:1 that the Word (the Λόγος [Logos], who became Jesus of Nazareth in 1:14) was with God (πρὸς τὸν θεόν, pro" ton qeon). Whatever else may be said, the statement in 17:5 strongly asserts the preexistence of Jesus Christ.

tn Grk “before the world was.” The word “created” is not in the Greek text but is implied.

tn The infinitive construct expressing the purpose of the preceding “walk” in the way of righteousness. These verses say that wisdom is always on the way of righteousness for the purposes of bestowing the same to those who find her. If sin is involved, then wisdom has not been followed.

tn The Piel imperfect continues the verbal idea that the infinitive began in the parallel colon even though it does not have the vav on the form.

tc The LXX adds at the end of this verse: “If I declare to you the things of daily occurrence, I will remember to recount the things of old.”

tn There are two roots קָנָה (qanah) in Hebrew, one meaning “to possess,” and the other meaning “to create.” The earlier English versions did not know of the second root, but suspected in certain places that a meaning like that was necessary (e.g., Gen 4:1; 14:19; Deut 32:6). Ugaritic confirmed that it was indeed another root. The older versions have the translation “possess” because otherwise it sounds like God lacked wisdom and therefore created it at the beginning. They wanted to avoid saying that wisdom was not eternal. Arius liked the idea of Christ as the wisdom of God and so chose the translation “create.” Athanasius translated it, “constituted me as the head of creation.” The verb occurs twelve times in Proverbs with the meaning of “to acquire”; but the Greek and the Syriac versions have the meaning “create.” Although the idea is that wisdom existed before creation, the parallel ideas in these verses (“appointed,” “given birth”) argue for the translation of “create” or “establish” (R. N. Whybray, “Proverbs 8:22-31 and Its Supposed Prototypes,” VT 15 [1965]: 504-14; and W. A. Irwin, “Where Will Wisdom Be Found?” JBL 80 [1961]: 133-42).

tn Verbs of creation often involve double accusatives; here the double accusative involves the person (i.e., wisdom) and an abstract noun in construct (IBHS 174-75 §10.2.3c).

tn Heb “his way” (so KJV, NASB). The word “way” is an idiom (implied comparison) for the actions of God.

tn The first parallel verb is נִסַּכְתִּי (nissakhti), “I was appointed.” It is not a common word; it occurs here and in Ps 2:6 for the coronation of the king. It means “installed, set.”

10 tn The verb “existed” does not appear in the Hebrew text, but has been supplied in the translation in the light of the context.

11 sn The summary statements just given are now developed in a lengthy treatment of wisdom as the agent of all creation. This verse singles out “watery deeps” (תְּהֹמוֹת, tÿhomot) in its allusion to creation because the word in Genesis signals the condition of the world at the very beginning, and because in the ancient world this was something no one could control. Chaos was not there first – wisdom was.

12 tn The third parallel verb is חוֹלָלְתִּי (kholalti), “I was given birth.” Some (e.g., KJV, NAB, NASB, NRSV) translate it “brought forth” – not in the sense of being presented, but in the sense of being “begotten, given birth to.” Here is the strongest support for the translation of קָנָה (qanah) as “created” in v. 22. The verb is not literal; it continues the perspective of the personification.

13 tn Heb “made heavy.”

14 tn Heb “open places.”

15 tn Here רֹאשׁ (rosh) means “beginning” with reference to time (BDB 911 s.v. 4.b).

16 sn The infinitive construct בְּחוּקוֹ (bÿkhuqo, “to cut; to engrave; to mark”) and the noun חוּג (khug, “horizon; circle”) form a paronomasia in the line.

17 tn To form a better parallel some commentators read this infinitive בַּעֲזוֹז (baazoz), “when [they] grew strong,” as a Piel causative, “when he made firm, fixed fast” (cf. NIV “fixed securely”; NLT “established”). But the following verse (“should not pass over”) implies the meaning “grew strong” here.

18 tn Heb “his mouth.”

19 tn The verb form is a preterite with vav consecutive, although it has not been apocopated. It provides the concluding statement for the temporal clauses as well as the parallel to v. 27.

20 tn Critical to the interpretation of this line is the meaning of אָמוֹן (’amon). Several suggestions have been made: “master craftsman” (cf. ASV, NASB, NIV, NRSV), “nursing child” (cf. NCV), “foster father.” R. B. Y. Scott chooses “faithful” – a binding or living link (“Wisdom in Creation: The ‘Amon of Proverbs 8:30,” VT 10 [1960]: 213-23). The image of a child is consistent with the previous figure of being “given birth to” (vv. 24, 25). However, “craftsman” has the most support (LXX, Vulgate, Syriac, Tg. Prov 8:30, Song 7:1; Jer 52:15; also P. W. Skehan, “Structures in Poems on Wisdom: Proverbs 8 and Sirach 24,” CBQ 41 [1979]: 365-79).

21 tn The word is a plural of intensification for “delight”; it describes wisdom as the object of delight. The LXX has the suffix; the Hebrew does not.

22 tn The two words are synonymous in general and so could be taken to express a superlative idea – the “whole world” (cf. NIV, NCV). But תֵּבֵל (tevel) also means the inhabited world, and so the construct may be interpreted as a partitive genitive.

23 tn Heb “and my delights” [were] with/in.”

24 tn Heb “the sons of man.”